MLB: New York Mets at Miami Marlins

The future of the Mets is not what you think

The Mets are not likely to trade top young pitching for a young, impact hitter, “The vision for contention under Sandy Alderson looks more like Oakland and Tampa Bay than the 2000 Mets,” team insiders have told columnist Andy Martino (Daily News, June 22).

The plan is simple, explains Martino, “Keep most of the high-end pitching, and construct an offense around more interchangeable pieces.”

According to Martino, while there may have been a deal to be made two to three years ago, this is no longer the case today.

“The overall lesson is that, with two wild cards and so much parity across baseball, it is hard to find sellers willing to part with superstars,” he writes. “So the Mets’ expectations have changed, and they are no longer anticipating that one big move. Such a trade is still possible, but increasingly unlikely.”

Matthew Cerrone, Lead Writer

This model shouldn’t be news to you, since I’ve talked about it a number of times, as recently as last month, writing, “The way I understand it, Alderson’s dream team will come to fruition because of a dominant, consistent, home-grown starting rotation, a financially-flexible, strike-out bullpen and disciplined, selective hitting with above-average power.This is not new. The Giants, Cardinals, A’s and Rays consistently win with a similar approach. Their pitching and farm systems are the backbones of their success, all while they shuffle hitters in, out and around two or three mainstays.”

In regards to Stanton, friends in Miami say he’s 100 percent off the market right now. The Marlins are winning, their pitching is thriving and they’re on the verge of yet another over-spend, tear-down, rebuild-and-win cycle. Stanton may be available this winter, but it will cost a Zack Wheeler, pitching prospects and at least one promising hitter, think C Kevin Plawecki.

I believe the Mets have the goods to get Rockies OF Carlos Gonzalez, who is due roughly $60 million through 2017. However, the Rockies will look to get the best talent back, they’re not interested in just cutting payroll. The thing is, Gonzalez is injured, often, and there will always be questions surrounding him about how his numbers will translate playing 81 games at Citi Field, though it helps that he hits left-handed.




491 comments
Pete Spaz
Pete Spaz

DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT TRADE Kevin Plawecki.

EVER! 

He is THE REAL DEAL, not d'arnaud.

Bryan McEntee
Bryan McEntee

Some other team will trade for Stanton. Then we will all laugh at Matt again. Then Matt will back track and come up with some excuse about why the Mets couldn't do the trade. Did he say just a few short months ago that we were going to trade for Ryan Braun? Now were supposed to believe that our pitching prospects are red headed step children that nobody wants to trade a bat for. Right.....

Bob Higgins
Bob Higgins

I'm sick of Alderson and the Wilpons ! They have no money and they keep trying to spin what the A's have done but they never make it past the 1st round of the playoffs ,. Sell the team !

metjetnet
metjetnet

This is true.

Due to parity & the expanded playoffs, no one is a seller anymore, especially for high-ticket talent.

Blame MLB for this one, boys, not Sandy...

Brett MacLeod
Brett MacLeod

its just excuses. sell the team if you can't afford to operate in the NY market. 

Steve Finelli
Steve Finelli

Sorry Matt but the Rays here in Tampa do not follow the model as you say at all.  They have traded pitching talent some of it young and some of it because of the young.  James Shields AND Wade Davis for Wil Myers.  Jason Hammel, Edwin Jackson and Scott Kazmir were all traded.  They traded Jesse Hahn and Alex Torres to Sand Diego last year for Logan Forsythe and Brad Boxberger.  Edwin Jackson was traded for Matt Joyce.  In fact if you look at their starting lineup tonight the only two homegrown position players are Longoria and Desmond Jennings.  The rest either via trade for young pitching or FA.

triviaace
triviaace

I'LL BELIEVE IT WHEN i SEE IT!

MetsFan1962
MetsFan1962

The translation of this article is simple. The Mets ownership is not going to trade for upgrades and not pay for proven talent.

j_spikett
j_spikett

stay the course. i have faith in alderson

Dave Kaye
Dave Kaye

The 1969 argument is probably the dumbest I ever heard. 2/3 was home grown lol so were most teams!!!! There was free agency. Trades weren't common. Journeymen players moved around. Good players stayed with 1 team their entire career outside of those guys that always wanted 1 more year. We're in 2014. The game has vastly changed since 1969 lol what a silly argument.

Patrick LeGrady
Patrick LeGrady

I've been saying this for months and then Gary and the guys said it the other night. Realize what your strength is and build around that. If we could have 8 guys that hit like Daniel Murphy the team would actually have an offense. The Mets need line drive hitters, not home run threats, we aren't the Yankees. That last game is exactly how we need to tool the offense. Stolen Bases, Squeeze Plays, Hit And Runs, Doubles and Triples, Sac Flys. Just productive situational hitting.

wilpondscm
wilpondscm

matt it is exactly what i think.....bleak, so long as its jeff's rich boy entitled toy and not run by competent people.

Darrell Smith
Darrell Smith

I woutd stay away from " Cargo " Because the price would be to high and he's been out a lot these past 3 seaons ,due to injuryes.

Shawn Sparks
Shawn Sparks

I'm on board with the idea that having 8 really good, well-rounded players in a lineup is better than having 1 great one, and I have no trouble accepting that it all starts with a strong farm system.  HOWEVER, if that's the plan, say so and stick to it.  Don't waste everybody's time throwing money at guys like Chris Young and Granderson just so you can host a couple of press conferences over the winter and put somebody's face on a season ticket ad.

kefhrny17
kefhrny17

The future for this organization is bleak because the Wilpons will still be owners, who'll still be in debt and will not want to spend on big ticket players.

Jerry Colfer
Jerry Colfer

Sandy is trying to make it work, but there is no safety net for errors (CY)

Here is the Wilpon/Katz model...We are the Wilpons and we are untouchable and no one can remove us from control of the team. All the debt we have incurred has been placed on the team and SNY network. We have no intention of selling, no intention of spending like a major market team and will use public relations and advertising gimmicks to string along my fan base. No one will do anything about it because the other owners and the faux commissioner guarantee... We are fine.

The value of the franchise in a major market will appreciate no matter what we do. We will act like we are interested in acquiring a big bat (like the latest Cuban defector), but we really have no intention of spending our money. You see fans, we are businessmen and this is just a cash cow for us in the future. So buckle up for a lot more pain.

dave42
dave42

By the way, I just read on fangraphs that the A's current 25-man roster has TWO homegrown players acquired through the draft.

Kenneth Meltsner
Kenneth Meltsner

5.5 games out is not insurmountable. But it IS with the team we now field. The biggest frustration I see on this site is with the team's willingness to accept the status quo. The team has gotten virtually no production from three position this year and yet we are still on the very edge of a playoff spot. TAKE A GAMBLE. LA needs an infielder. Detroit needs a decent closer. Throw in one of those many quadruple A players to sweeten the pot. I cannot pretend to speak for everyone on this site I, for one, would like to see Sandy make a deal for someone other than the Rick Ankiel's and Bobby Abreu's of the world. I want nothing more than to watch my favorite team play interesting and meaningful ball in August and September.

Rob Martin
Rob Martin

So we must wait on the pitching ?? You gotta do better then that or confess to your fans that we are no where near a WS contention. You have to trade some players. For the love of God you're gonna keep losing fans. Wake the heck up already.

Steve Finelli
Steve Finelli

@Darrell Smith Agreed.  BTW I'd trade Zack Wheeler and Plawecki in a heartbeat for Stanton.  Miami would never do it!

jenkins
jenkins

@Jerry Colfer Excellent post. But if nobody goes to the games, there will be a change. Can Mets fans stop spending  on games and gear?

dooley
dooley

Yeah, most of their big prospects had come via trade

jenkins
jenkins

@dave42 A's have a spectacular scouting system. So do the Giants, but Giants have a lot of money.

dminches
dminches

@Kenneth Meltsner Those are the deals they need to make, but who do they have to trade that anyone wants?  It would be 1 thing if Parnell was healthy.  They don't have a closer to trade and they don't have an infielder to trade that will return anything valuable today.


dminches
dminches

@Dr. Jonathan Reefer I don't think anyone think SA has done a good job but rather the blame isn't entirely his.


I will say, all the people who say he has done a bad job do it without specific moves they would have made, and I don't mean trades since who knows if the other team is willing to do that.

dave42
dave42

@jenkins @Jerry Colfer  to be fair, they never acted like they were interested in Abreu.  My read on Alderson regarding Tomas is that he's being coy.  I hope. 

jenkins
jenkins

@dooley their real break was signing Cespedes, who could have gone anywhere.

dave42
dave42

@dminches @Kenneth Meltsner  I should love to send Flores and maybe another player (deGrom, Montero too much?  Maybe Gorski or Bowman?) to the Dodgers for Joc Pederson. 

cver
cver

@dminches @Dr. Jonathan Reefer He probably could have gotten Michael Morse if he overpayed and skipped Colon and Chris Young and let Ike go.  He would have been able to hold down 1B and/or the OF.  He was worth taking a chance on, as the Giants figured out.  That's just one example.  I would have also, as I've said a bunch of times, traded Niese for Reyes, while Reyes' value was down and his salary is still up high, but I don't see Toronto trading him now, as he has fueled their success.

cver
cver

@dave42 @jenkins @Jerry Colfer It's like this.  Even if he is interested and the owners are up to a point, Tomas price will be sky high and Alderson will later say that he didn't anticipate the price to be that high - the proverbial "sticker shock" and that's that.  Remember, he doesn't want to give more than one or two guys 100 million dollar contracts and I doubt he wants to give another big contract after Granderson and Wright.  He will also eventually have to either trade or do extensions with Murphy and whoever else down the line.  Certainly Harvey's name comes to mind, but that's a long ways off and there's no way with Boras, I guess, that Harvey doesn't hit free agency (unless he becomes a disappointment).  Gee is one who will eventually hit free agency too, but I have a feeling he will get traded before that.  I have no clue who the hell they are thinking of to win with.  Just pitching and lousy hitters?  Even the Giants had more than that.  They got lucky to have Posey on the cheap, since he's still a youngin'.  And they have a big payroll, so they're a bad example that has been used a lot.  And yes, the A's and Rays - and do you think it's just a coincidence that neither of those teams have won anything (well, the A's 25 years ago, but that was fueled by steroids).

Jerry Colfer
Jerry Colfer

Yeah, I agree on Abreau. I would hope as well on Tomas, but have a hard time seeing SA getting the funds to make it happen. I hope I am dead wrong on that.

jenkins
jenkins

@dooley but they really excel at signing retreads who produce, like Moss and Lowrie.

dooley
dooley

@Dr. Jonathan Reefer That is so awesome that you are a botanist with your name

dminches
dminches

@Dr. Jonathan Reefer If you can't do his job then maybe you can't assess how well he has done his?  And if that's the case then this entire board is a waste of time.

dave42
dave42

@Jerry Colfer  well as I have said elsewhere, if they move Colon, along with CY's expiring, they should have $15-17mil available.  Even if you assume Tomas is going for more than Abreu due to crowd-thinking, there should be enough in the coffers to get a deal done.

dooley
dooley

@jenkins no doubt, and their platoons actually produce all star level production while keeping costs down.

jenkins
jenkins

@dooley Exactly-it's fascinating to watch Beane work. 

jenkins
jenkins

@dooley or Coco Crisp, who is a grat leadoff man and CF. Nobody wanted him.


Got Donaldson as a throw- in for Gaudin and Harden. He was a catcher.


Beane's system is amazing.

dooley
dooley

@jenkins Yeah it is absolutely incredible what Beane has done, and continues to do. I think the real key to the model is discovering undervalued prospects in other organizations, like when Alderson acquired Herrera. Herrera is the youngest player in the Eastern League, and should be ranked much higher in prospect lists next year. Hopefully DePodesta can continue that trend, because Gee and Colon aren't going to net blue chip prospects or all stars

dave42
dave42

@dooley  I would be surprised if Colon doesn't bring back a good prospect - not a great one like a Taveras from St. Louis who is major league ready, but perhaps more of the Wheeler "great prospect but in high-A" mold. 

jenkins
jenkins

@dooley agree on all counts. The trick for Alderson will be proposing multiple players for players quietly on the blocks-like Sandoval. He'd be worth the risk. Murphy and a pitcher would get it done. Giants need a starter badly.


I'd do that in a second.

dave42
dave42

@jenkins @dooley  where you gonna play Fat Ichiro?  3B?  2B?  You know he's a free agent at year end right?  And if we trade for him and don't re-sign, we don't get a pick.

jenkins
jenkins

@dave42 @jenkins @dooley I'd play him at 3rd or 1st, and then decide what I'm going to do with Murphy and Duda. If Murphy is dealt-Wright to 2nd. And I would definitely deal Murphy. Wright would bat third and Pablo 4th. Totally changes the lineup for the better.