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News: Wilmer Flores cleared for action after jamming finger

Triple-A SS Wilmer Flores had X-rays on his hand that came back negative.

He has been cleared to return to baseball activities.

Flores jammed his finger in a game with Triple-A Las Vegas this past Sunday, which forced him to leave the game after three innings.

Flores is hitting .250 with one HR, six errors and 11 RBI in 20 games this season with Triple-A.




136 comments
upstaphan
upstaphan

Joooseeeeeee Jose Jose Jossee Joseeeeeee Joooseee

archer41
archer41

Why focus on just the 6 errors.  He's not hitting either making this discussion academic.  The fans that are pushing for Flores are presumably on the premise that his hitting will overcome his obvious lack of defense.  If he's not hitting (like right now), then all of this is moot.

joeknix
joeknix

For any other professional sports team in NY NOT named the Mets if a solution can be solved with little risk and some money then why not do it.  Drew is sitting at home and all it takes is money and a 3rd round pick and we still haven't pulled the trigger. . . Why do the Mets make everything so difficult!

rstpigeon
rstpigeon

The team is cruising on good pitching. Tejada is not costing them games. Can't afford to be weak up the middle. 6 errors is abominable and Flores's offense is not good enough to make up for it. He belongs at a corner, where he can f do no harm. His numbers show passable promise as a backup 3B. I know he's only 22 but, ask yourself, if he were in  another organization, what would they do with him? Time to be honest, if they make Flores into a decent 3B, he can be traded in a package.


Best to stick with someone who doesn't suck in the field while you need, above all, to be pitching your way to victory.

thehat
thehat

Flores isn't a SS.  The 6 errors don't even count his horrible range.   That said, Tejada has got to go.  He's been better defensively the last week or so, but is still a negative defensive player on the season as a whole by every metric.  If the Mets want a no-hit, defensive player then they should call up Tovar who has an elite glove at the position.  He'd be one of the top defensive SS in the majors, which is not something Tejada will ever be and at this point, he can't be any worse with the bat...a .530 OPS?  Yikes...

7up17_2go
7up17_2go

Two words:  Matt Reynolds  .390 avg   .460 on base %  23 years old.

qualcomm
qualcomm

Didn't we do this dance with Daniel Murphy and second base a while ago?  Can't we just skip the theatrics and get it over with already?  Let him try.

Ramon Pena
Ramon Pena

Im not saying he isn't good im just saying that Plawecki looks like he could be a better player than him even when we saw weiters struggle in his first year you could see something I don't see that in DArnaud

Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

i have not yet come to any conclusions but i like feedback. I come to a belief that Flores is not a everyday in one positon player. its good he should know all the infield positions for his own future growth but since I do not think trading Murphy is a good future decision i wonder if the SF Giants who need a second baseman if they would trade a good reliever from their minor league system for Flores or a ss in their system.    To TexasMetsfan if he moved back to ss after not playing that position for 3 years you should not get alarmed at the errors he is basically relearning the positon i would cut him slack for that errors.   But what do people think about trading Flores to get something we may need that can help us right away.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@joeknix  If you sign Drew now, he'd need 3 weeks to get in playing shape, and can't expect to truly contribute at the ML level for another 2.  That means June.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@rstpigeon  Hanley Ramirez has 5 errors at SS this season.  Would you expect Mattingly to bench Ramirez and his bat and play Justin Turner at SS because Turner may be a better defender?  I don't think so.

thehat
thehat

@7up17_2go  He might be resurrecting his career as a 2nd round pick back in 2012, but be careful here....he's a guy with 0 power who's been a .240ish hitter prior to this.  That said, with the Mets SS situation pretty much anyone with a solid glove should get a shot at some point.

nncyel
nncyel

@qualcomm  Try what? SS at the major league level? Why? The Mets aren't 5-18 right now. They're not the Cubs. Why would they behave like the basement dweller most posters this past winter expected them to be? Right now, they're competitive - no reason to experiment for the hell of experimenting.

jamets
jamets

I think people are grossly overrating Plawecki based on 1 good season.  He doesn't have close to the tools d'Arnaud does. 

qualcomm
qualcomm

@Ron W. Davis I think we have to learn what we have.  We already lost the chance to sell him as an over-valued blue chip prospect... now just go with it.  It's like what they should have done with Ike Davis to me, trade him when he's at a peak if you can forecast the problems or just ride it out. 

crafalko17
crafalko17

@Ron W. Davis His only everyday position would be 3B...just not on this team. They are simply trying to build value atm, not sure if it is working though. Hopefully he gets blazing hot again and hits .350 over the summer.

nncyel
nncyel

@Ron W. Davis  Absolutely trade him. Here's what Wilmer Flores is: a third baseman who has a better player in front of him at 3b, and a second baseman who has a better player in front of him at 2b. His lack of defensive ability at SS will prevent him from displacing Tejada, unless Tejada is hitting below .200 in another month or so. 


Re-learning the position? Poppycock! I played SS through JVs in college and I could play the position right now after more years not playing baseball than I care to reveal. You either have the ability or you don't. He's not relearning anything - he's simply not a great or even good defensive shortstop.


Please trade him if for no other reason that posters will stop putting ridiculous expectations upon him. Another poster mentioned that Hanley Ramirez also has a number of errors this spring. How can you compare Wilmer Flores to Hanley Ramirez. Flores will never, ever be the hitter that Ramirez is. 

Brian McCarthy
Brian McCarthy

That's fine, but this team needs an above average glove at ss.But we need a real bat in this lineup.A Cargo type bat, or Tulo.Would cost a real good pitcher plus more, but I think it will need to get done soon.

rstpigeon
rstpigeon

@doubleday @rstpigeonFlores is no Hanley Ramirez, not even close, not even a fraction of the hitter that Ramirez is. And he isn't going to be. Can't compare these two situations. As I said, Flores's bat is not good enough to offset his middle infield play. That's a fact.


When you're cruising on pitching, you need better defense than Flores will provide, that, too, is a simple fact of the game.


Give me a better comparison.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@rstpigeon  As I commented below, In his ROY season, at age 22, Ramirez batted .292 with 17 HR 59 RBI and 26 errors.  I'd say those are pretty comparable to Flores' projected numbers.

qualcomm
qualcomm

@nncyel It's not "for the hell of", it's to get a bat into the lineup and be proactive.  We're smoke and mirrors right now and you know it. 

If we can somehow switch some better talent in before we collapse, maybe we won't.   Look at his bat through the system... this is not a singles hitter. 

C.K. Dexter Haven
C.K. Dexter Haven

@nncyel  Oh, no...it's not for the hell of it.  It's for the HATRED of Tejada playing SS for this team.  Something that i'm not quite sure is warranted.  As for Flores and Murph..at least Murph showed an athletic ability and dexterity enough to play multiple positions.  It was just a matter of time (and necessity) before they found his spot.  Flores, is proving more and more at best he is a serviceable 2B and at worst he is Jeff Keppinger.  A DH with not enough power to actually play DH.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@jamets  Plawecki isn't exactly tearing up AA.  He's hitting .250

Doubleday
Doubleday

@nncyel @Ron W. Davis  In his ROY season, at age 22, Ramirez batted .292 with 17 HR 59 RBI and 26 errors.  I'd say those are pretty comparable to Flores' projected numbers.

Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

@nncyel i based a player against themselves more then compare them to another player its hard to compare two players . there are some you can but mostly i weigh a player against their selves a year before or two.  So i feel my expecations are fair but its hard to say when you hardly saw them i know from Mets history we over estimated our players. How many next Tom Seavers i heard about unfair to the upcoming player to be saddled down with that. I remember Roy Staiger to be the next Brooks Robinson he was not even Hubie Brooks. or Brooke Benton. lol

Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

@nncyel another way of looking at it is to save David wright from aging and injurys maybe you can move DW to first base if you really believed this kid is best position is 3rd but i hightly think the Mets at this point would not consider it nothing to do with Smith to far down the road but unliked Zimmerman who may have to move to first i do not think the Mets have right now a need to move Wright to first.  but i think two things that concern me about Flores is first he is not a natural defensive player at any position he is a copy of Murphy from the right side but unproven in majors. and too many freak little injurys  So i say move him if you can get value back. 

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @nncyel @rstpigeon  So there is a one-to-one correspondence between PCL hitting stats and MLB stats? I think you need to brush up on your understanding of how PCL hitters fare when they make the jump to the majors.


Also, Flores is not exactly seizing on his opportunity right now is he?

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @rstpigeon  You're sticking to your guns - good. You might be right. Two years from now, when Wilmer Flores has won the 2015 ROY at shortstop and is on his way to being a dominant hitter in this league, I'll remember this conversation and apologize. But right now I think you're crazy. Sorry.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@rstpigeon @doubleday  "That's a fact."  Really?


Age 21 in AAA, Flores batted .359/15/86.  Same age, same level, Ramirez batted .271/6/52

rstpigeon
rstpigeon

@mets2death @doubleday@rstpigeonFlores is not the solution at SS, and he isn't going to be. Why settle for less that what you have the field for someone who hasn't shown the slightest skill in hitting MLB pitching, even less than Tejada?


In order to make the argument for bringing up a liability in order to develop that liability into an asset, the team needs a lot more stability in other areas.


Think about the game, think about winning, and stop thinking about this teams pet farm projects and ho you wish would suddenly blossom into a hero. Flores is a long way off the mark, by any objective measure, and they're doing him a disservice, hurting his career possibilities, by trying to make him into a middle infielder.


rstpigeon
rstpigeon

@doubleday @rstpigeonNo way! there is not a chance in hell that Flores has this hitting potential.


If he were in the Cardinal's system, or Florida's, even, he'd be moving up or moving out. The tolerance for mediocrity and hope for the players this organization clings to is astounding.


He belongs at an infield corner and he'll only break into the bigs as a  backup if his hitting doesn't radically improve. Take off the blue and orange glasses and just look at the player. then look at the track record of  the Mets in developing these "promising" young hitters, how they cling to guys who have so much unfulfilled "potential" - Valdespin, Milledge, Martinez. Every one of them could have been forced to move up, been better coached, been looked at more objectively, and even traded.

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @rstpigeon  Oh my god. I try to stay unemotional, and we're all entitled to our opinions but you're trending into the irrational here. So the Mets organization is suppressing the next ROY down on the farm in favor of Ruben Tejada? You don't do your credibility any favors comparing Flores to Ramirez. 


Projected by who? Based on minor league stats in a hitter's league? I don't see Flores putting up those numbers and I don't think the organization does either. And at Flores current error rate per game, Flores would have close to 50 errors over the same number of games Ramirez played his rookie season. Not good.

nncyel
nncyel

@qualcomm  No, I don't know that. Pitching and defense is a smart foundation to build upon - that's what the Mets have done and it's paying dividends. Agreed that based on their offensive numbers they shouldn't be winning but that's what pitching and defense can do. Fans are happier when the team wins 9-7 than 3-1 and somehow think that's more reliable. 


And I'd be happy to get Flores bat into the lineup if he had shown me anything in his brief appearances on the big club. He hasn't. It's not like they're keeping the next Alex Rodriguez suppressed down on the farm.

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @nncyel @qualcomm @C.K. Dexter Haven  Fair point. And perhaps Flores at 2B depending on who was the better defender at each position. But when they signed Wright that's when they knew Flores days at 3B as a Met were over and they needed to find a new home for him.

Doubleday
Doubleday

@nncyel @qualcomm @C.K. Dexter Haven  I don't think so.  Flores is barely 22 years old.  He's still maturing.  If Wright had not signed, Murphy would be the starting 3B.  It was Murph who moved to 2B because he was blocked by Wright.  

C.K. Dexter Haven
C.K. Dexter Haven

@qualcomm  My friend I invite you to go take a look at Flores' E's as a SS in the minors...THEN look at his range factor as a 3B.   Murph absolutely is not the same 2B today as he was 2 years ago. I'll grant you that.  It's lucky for him the Mets had an ABSOLUTE NEED at 2B (Castillo was...ugh).  This thing with Tejada is simply fans who bought in to everything written about him, and he's at the Mendoza line.  But here's the thing...for most of April the entire TEAM was at the Mendoza line.


Strong defense up the middle right?  Ok.  Let's flip flop Flores and Tejada so far this season, using your best estimate and factoring in Flores' .250 avg, better power, 6 E's, limited range etc, and Tejada's weak avg and weaker hits, but solid D (on some nights spectacular).  Can anyone honestly say the Mets would be 14-11 with Flores at SS?


I grew up watching ball in the '70s so those are where my sensibilities stem from...middle infielders weren't asked to drive in runs or even table set.  They were simply asked to either clear the pitcher's spot or keep the conga line moving, and play solid defense.  Well...?

nncyel
nncyel

@qualcomm @C.K. Dexter Haven  He's a third baseman. SS is a step up in defense in terms of footwork and mobility. By all accounts he's not going to be able to make that step up which is why the Mets moved him to 2B after they signed Wright long term and weren't sure Murphy would work out at 2B. Murphy did work out. No place for Flores. Moreover, you're overvaluing his bat. 


If they hadn't signed Wright, Flores would be the Mets third baseman. Go look at the timeline of where he was playing when in relation to when they signed Wright. You'll see exactly what I'm talking about.

qualcomm
qualcomm

@C.K. Dexter Haven I think you're a bit off-base, Flores is known for having great hands and a great arm, while Murph was known for batting 3rd.  Flores ONLY problem was range, which was said to have improved.   Murphy isn't exactly Carl Lewis.

Flores has just the bat to be an outstanding hitting SS if he can be serviceable.


Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

@C.K. Dexter Haven @nncyeli think Murphy has improved withen his limited defense talent thats all i can ask from him without it effecting his offense.  we can live with Murphy everyday as long as he plays solid too me i rather have him at second then the Braves Ugla

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @nncyel @Ron W. Davis  And Ramirez has a long major league history at the position during which he's averaged 13 errors per season. That's how we know he won't make 50 errors. Flores has no such history. 

C.K. Dexter Haven
C.K. Dexter Haven

@doubleday You honestly think Flores can come to Queens and hit 15 HRs this year?   


BTW, slightly OT, do all the Met affiliate stadiums have the same OF configurations as Citi?  If not why not?  I know they're cheap, but how much can that cost?

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @nncyel @Ron W. Davis  And they moved him off the position because of his range as well, or lack thereof. Something that doesn't show up in the error stats but does show up in W-L. 

Doubleday
Doubleday

@nncyel @Ron W. Davis  Same age, almost identical lines.  As for the errors, Hanley has 5 in the bigs already this year.  Does anyone really expect him to have 50 for the season?  Of course not.

nncyel
nncyel

@doubleday @nncyel @Ron W. Davis  Projected by who? Based on minor league stats in a hitter's league? I don't see Flores putting up those numbers and I don't think the organization does either. And at Flores current error rate per game, Flores would have close to 50 errors over the same number of games Ramirez played his rookie season. Not good.

Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

@nncyel some players you groom for your team and some you groom to trade. like to get Santana we had to trade Carlos Gomez and that was ok we have to give up young talent to get talent. but i see not NL team that can use Flores because like Duda they are meant to be DH or bench players .

Ron W. Davis
Ron W. Davis

@nncyel I want to be patient with kids but i see no natural positon and I think Murphy has done a good job but because he is a good hitter you can put him with his so called short comings defensivly but you can't just put one demential players in the lineup we have a lesser first baseman and second baseman but second is ok because he is a ok hitter. ss is less existant and then Wright is the best glove in our infield by far.